It seems that you're using an outdated browser. Some things may not work as they should (or don't work at all).
We suggest you upgrade newer and better browser like: Chrome, Firefox, Internet Explorer or Opera

×
Something that's really bothering me about DK1 is whenever I try and get my guys to fight the enemy they don't do anything.

Like I'll tunnel into an enemy base and then drop all my guys there and they won't do anything they'll instead retreat. Using the flag thing does nothing. It's only when an enemy's attacking them that they'll SUDDENLY decide to fight them. In one mission it took several tries to get the AI to finally convince itself it was worth attacking the enemy.

Can someone please explain what mechanic I'm not understanding? I created all of the rooms I thought were necessary and trained up my guys but this keeps happening.

Full disclosure I am playing the game with KeeperFX, not the original DOS version.
Post edited August 21, 2018 by DeadYorick
This question / problem has been solved by Bookwyrm627image
avatar
DeadYorick: Full disclosure I am playing the game with KeeperFX, not the original DOS version.
Fair warning: I'm unfamiliar with KeeperFX, so I don't know what it has changed.
avatar
DeadYorick: Something that's really bothering me about DK1 is whenever I try and get my guys to fight the enemy they don't do anything.
If you drop your creatures next to enemy creatures, then fighting will generally ensue. There are limitations, though.

-If you've set the "Flee" option, then your badly injured creatures will try to leave the fight. If "Flee" is not set (if it is not flashing), then your creatures should fight to the death.

-Only so many creatures can participate in a battle at once, even if they are all ranged. If some creatures are standing there hopping, then they are effectively cheering on the ones that are actually fighting. The 'audience' will start fighting as combatants fall or retreat.

-Imps will pretty much always try to flee combat, except against other imps. Your imps and enemy imps will happily try to kill each other, but (wisely) they will run from anything stronger.
avatar
DeadYorick: Like I'll tunnel into an enemy base and then drop all my guys there and they won't do anything they'll instead retreat.
If you just dropped your creatures at the edge of the enemy dungeon, then they'll just try to go home if they don't see any creatures (including imps) to fight. Creatures don't attack the rooms of an enemy dungeon. They will attack enemy doors if they are dropped close enough (an enemy door is any door that isn't under your control).

They will also attack a dungeon heart if you can drop them close enough. Keep in mind that you can drop them at the edges of tiles that you've claimed, which may put them that much closer to the heart.
avatar
DeadYorick: Using the flag thing does nothing. It's only when an enemy's attacking them that they'll SUDDENLY decide to fight them. In one mission it took several tries to get the AI to finally convince itself it was worth attacking the enemy.
If you are talking about the Call To Arms spell (which has a flag symbol), then the spell just causes all of your creatures in its radius of effect (charge it up for a greater range) to walk around where the flag is. You'll have to cast the spell to get your creatures to follow it. You can therefore move it toward and through an enemy dungeon to guide all of your creatures toward some location. If they encounter enemy creatures, doors, or the Heart, then they'll attack.

Maintenance on Call To Arms is free if you cast it on tiles you control. It can get expensive quickly once you cast it on tiles you don't control.

Creatures might choose to leave the flag if they get too hurt or hungry. I'm not sure about this aspect of behavior.
avatar
DeadYorick: Can someone please explain what mechanic I'm not understanding? I created all of the rooms I thought were necessary and trained up my guys but this keeps happening.
Creating the relevant rooms is what lets you attract those creatures in the first place. For example, you won't get any warlocks through your portal if you don't have a Library.

Training just increases their experience, which leads to higher levels, which leads to higher stats and maybe some extra skills.

Neither having the relevant rooms nor training your creatures makes much difference in how your creatures engage in combat.
The poster above is correct, your creatures will not invade an enemy dungeon on its own. They will only fight enemy units and an enemy dungeon heart if they are in close range.

There are several ways to accomplish this. The easiest way is to provoke the enemy into defending, simply assign an imp to claim his rooms, this will inevitably result into conflict and you throw your units near the enemy.

Casting CTA is another option, cast CTA in range of creatures to get their attention (hold the button down longer to cast a bigger range, but more expensive spell), and click at another location to get your units to move there. Repeat until they are in range of the enemy dungeon heart or enemy units.

A third way is to use the barracks room. Throw a bunch in that room, and cast the possess spell on 1 of them. Then walk towards the enemy, with up to 7 allies following you.
avatar
Bookwyrm627: -If you've set the "Flee" option, then your badly injured creatures will try to leave the fight. If "Flee" is not set (if it is not flashing), then your creatures should fight to the death.
how do I set this? Where in the interface?
In the menu there are 5 tabs: ?/stats - rooms - spells - traps - units.
It's on the first one, with the big question mark. Behind it you see two buttons, one is a prison (and can be clicked only when you have a prison to set imprisonment on), the other the retreat button, shaped like a chicken.
Post edited August 22, 2018 by Loobinex
avatar
Loobinex: cast CTA in range of creatures to get their attention
Alternatively, cast it near the edge of your territory, then just grab the creatures you want and drop them near the flag.
avatar
Loobinex: A third way is to use the barracks room. Throw a bunch in that room, and cast the possess spell on 1 of them. Then walk towards the enemy, with up to 7 allies following you.
I thought the barracks allowed you to recruit up to as many creatures as the barracks had tiles. So a 5x5 barracks would let you lead up to 24 creatures (25 tiles, but you possess one of them).
avatar
Bookwyrm627: -If you've set the "Flee" option, then your badly injured creatures will try to leave the fight. If "Flee" is not set (if it is not flashing), then your creatures should fight to the death.
avatar
DeadYorick: how do I set this? Where in the interface?
On the left hand side, below the mini-map, there is a panel with 5 tabs. One tab has the buildings, one tab has the spells, one has doors and traps.

The left most tab looks like a question mark. Select it to bring up the info panel. Near the top of the panel, just above the "Time until pay day" bar, are two buttons. One button has a chicken head; this is the "Flee when low on health" button (your monsters will walk away from a battle when low on health, instead of fighting to the death). The other button can only be selected if you have a prison, and it tells your creatures to knock the enemy out instead of killing them (be aware that sometimes accidents happen, and an enemy dies anyway).
Attachments:
avatar
Bookwyrm627: I thought the barracks allowed you to recruit up to as many creatures as the barracks had tiles. So a 5x5 barracks would let you lead up to 24 creatures (25 tiles, but you possess one of them).
The barracks does no such thing. Every map has a set limit for each player, past that number no creatures come through the portal. (So, to get maximum amount of creatures, make sure to get to that number before you get more units found on the map or through your prison)
Also, on the Query tab, you can see how many units you have. When it blinks, you're at or over your creature limit and nothing will get through the portal anymore.

The barracks' only use is what I said, to lead parties in first-person mode. That's hardly ever useful, but here is a map that relies on that mechanic. Most people simply build a single tile of barracks so they get Orcs.
avatar
Bookwyrm627: I thought the barracks allowed you to recruit up to as many creatures as the barracks had tiles. So a 5x5 barracks would let you lead up to 24 creatures (25 tiles, but you possess one of them).
avatar
Loobinex: The barracks does no such thing. Every map has a set limit for each player, past that number no creatures come through the portal. (So, to get maximum amount of creatures, make sure to get to that number before you get more units found on the map or through your prison)
Also, on the Query tab, you can see how many units you have. When it blinks, you're at or over your creature limit and nothing will get through the portal anymore.

The barracks' only use is what I said, to lead parties in first-person mode. That's hardly ever useful, but here is a map that relies on that mechanic. Most people simply build a single tile of barracks so they get Orcs.
Confusion sowed by my use of "recruit".

I didn't mean a barracks helps get units to enter through the portal (except Orcs, since it is a required building for them). I meant you can lead more than 7 units around if you have a larger barracks. I've led a LOT more than 7 by making an over sized barracks, dropping a lot of guys in, and possessing one to be the leader.
avatar
Bookwyrm627: I didn't mean a barracks helps get units to enter through the portal (except Orcs, since it is a required building for them). I meant you can lead more than 7 units around if you have a larger barracks. I've led a LOT more than 7 by making an over sized barracks, dropping a lot of guys in, and possessing one to be the leader.
Checking, it's not 7, it's 8. I thought it was the leader and 7 more, but apparently the leader does not count. So unless you consider '1' a LOT, no you haven't.
This limit is unrelated to the barracks, so a larger room won't help. What happens is that a 'group' or 'party' is formed, and groups in this game can be no larger than 8. The same thing with groups of invading heroes, which can't contain more than 8 heroes either. (If you see more than 8 heroes, that either means they belong to more than one group, or aren't grouped at all). A group is a bunch of units that stay together and follow a leader.
avatar
Loobinex: Checking, it's not 7, it's 8. I thought it was the leader and 7 more, but apparently the leader does not count. So unless you consider '1' a LOT, no you haven't.
This limit is unrelated to the barracks, so a larger room won't help. What happens is that a 'group' or 'party' is formed, and groups in this game can be no larger than 8. The same thing with groups of invading heroes, which can't contain more than 8 heroes either. (If you see more than 8 heroes, that either means they belong to more than one group, or aren't grouped at all). A group is a bunch of units that stay together and follow a leader.
I'll have to remember to test that sometime. I've never actually counted the dots, but I have dropped a truck load of creatures in a giant barracks, and I seem to recall a whole lot of them following me. Been a long time since I bothered with a barracks, though.
avatar
DeadYorick: ...
This is really my main complaint about this game. It's just so difficult to control creatures and launch a proper attack. (It's also diffcult to select creatures by level e.g. I want to attack only with level 10 skeletons and keep the others training - but that's a different story). Just too much frustration getting the creatures do what you want them to do, and finally having them all squished by a boulder trap.

Add to that single-player levels that weren't even properly QAed it seems. Some can be rushed with your starting forces. While for others you need to do eveything just right because if you accidentally drill into an enemy pocket, you're dead.
avatar
ZFR: This is really my main complaint about this game. It's just so difficult to control creatures and launch a proper attack. (It's also diffcult to select creatures by level e.g. I want to attack only with level 10 skeletons and keep the others training - but that's a different story). Just too much frustration getting the creatures do what you want them to do, and finally having them all squished by a boulder trap.
You can grab the 8 highest level creatures of a particular type. On the creature summary panel, click on the creature's face and the hand will grab one of creatures that have the highest level among that creature type.

Boulder traps are still rough, though. Of course, they are also quite lovely to use against the enemy. :D
avatar
Bookwyrm627: You can grab the 8 highest level creatures of a particular type. On the creature summary panel, click on the creature's face and the hand will grab one of creatures that have the highest level among that creature type.
Are you sure that always choose by highest level? What if I want to select the lowest (to send them to training room for example).
That's always a bother with imps. I usually train them till level 3, and send them to work. It's then difficult to select them once they reach it from the summary panel. Instead I end up fishing for them one by one in the training room.
avatar
Bookwyrm627: You can grab the 8 highest level creatures of a particular type. On the creature summary panel, click on the creature's face and the hand will grab one of creatures that have the highest level among that creature type.
avatar
ZFR: Are you sure that always choose by highest level? What if I want to select the lowest (to send them to training room for example).
That's always a bother with imps. I usually train them till level 3, and send them to work. It's then difficult to select them once they reach it from the summary panel. Instead I end up fishing for them one by one in the training room.
Yeah, clicking on the monster's face (not in one of the three boxes next to the face!) should grab the highest level monster (though not necessarily the most experienced monster with that level). If you have five level 9 skeletons, then clicking on the skeleton face 3 times will select 3 of them, clicking 5 times total should grab all 5, and clicking 6 times will grab the 5 level 9s and then one skeleton that is at the next highest level.

Sadly, the creature panel only provides four options for grabbing creatures of a specific type: highest level, idle, working, and fighting. You'll have to find creatures manually if you want to be more specific than that.

One work-around idea for sorting through a large number of creatures that work: create a locked room, grab working creatures, and toss the ones you don't want into the locked room. The ones that are locked up will become idle, so you can keep grabbing 'new' creatures from the working category. Unlock the door once you've gotten what you wanted.
avatar
Bookwyrm627: Yeah, clicking on the monster's face (not in one of the three boxes next to the face!)
Ah! Never tried that. Always the boxes.

avatar
Bookwyrm627: One work-around idea for sorting through a large number of creatures that work: create a locked room, grab working creatures, and toss the ones you don't want into the locked room. The ones that are locked up will become idle, so you can keep grabbing 'new' creatures from the working category. Unlock the door once you've gotten what you wanted.
That's what I do sometimes. Always while thinking "Surely there got to be a better way. This is ridiculous".